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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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hello and welcome to the skeptic zone

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episode number 327 for the 25th of

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January 2015 Richard Saunders here with

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you from the Bay Area San Francisco and

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I think I brought some of the warm

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weather with me there are blooms on the

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trees flowers are coming out the days

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are fine and warm something is wrong

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folks I expected to be wrapped up in

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jumpers and coats and scarves and hats

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and gloves and all sorts of things no

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I'm getting around in um more or less a

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t-shirt but at least it's not as mucky

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as Sydney but that's enough of the

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winter report what's coming up on this

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week's show we're going to kick off with

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an interview with a really interesting

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fellow kidding joshi he's going to be

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talking about energy wind farms and wind

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farm illness or wind farm disease or

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wind farmed apparent negative effects

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from wind farms and things like that is

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it all in the mind is it all in the air

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is it all blowing in the wind find out

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with our interview coming up at the top

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of the show following that it's a week

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in science from our good friends at the

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Royal Institution of Australia and I

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think they've got a different backing

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track this week yes they've moved for

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the times a different backing tracker

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different music hmm see we think of that

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and then the round off the show it's a

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series of interviews with Maynard

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chatting to people at the Australian

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skeptics convention which was held last

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November sort of a grab bag of people

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lining up to get into various events

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what they think why they're there that

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sort of stuff and one of the people

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interviewed by Maynard is none other

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than Barry Williams Barry Williams known

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to Australian skeptics he's one of the

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most famous members of Australian

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skeptic he was the president for many

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years he was there right from the

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kickoff he's retired now but he came out

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of retirement to join us at the

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convention always an interesting man to

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chat to and also some extra bits from

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Michael Marshall and lots of other

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people too including some friends of

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ours from the Victorian skeptics that's

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coming up at the end of the show and

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speaking of may nod if you go to Maynard

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com got a

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there are videos and audio clips up

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there recently the radio station Triple

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J here in Australia celebrated its 40th

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birthday and Maynard for those in

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Australia of course Maynard was a huge

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part of triple j ah so go to Maynard

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comdata you and look for the triple j

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videos and audio thanks for those people

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who wrote in saying how much they

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enjoyed our new reporter Heidi Robertson

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the raw skeptic her report where she

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visited mind body spirit mind muddy

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wallet New Age fair whatever you want to

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call it and it really that reminds me I

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mean I've been going to these things for

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years and years and years as a skeptic

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zone listeners will know and I guess I

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really did need a fresh set of ears and

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eyes there to remind me something which

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is very important about these

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mind-body-spirit fairs is the fact that

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a lot of people there purporting to be

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healers or whatever simply don't know

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what they're talking about they've read

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junk they've put their own junk on top

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with junk we're wrapped in woo they

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think they know they have half an idea

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fine everybody's entitled to their

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opinion if they have half an idea of

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half an idea but I guess the point is

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these people are imparting this

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knowledge as if they know how people

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should handle their health and give

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advice and a lot of times they'll charge

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for it its consumer affairs issues with

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mind-body wallet festivals their safety

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issues ultimately there are people just

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peddling nonsense and dangerous nonsense

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of that maybe over this year 2015 will

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look more into the that aspect of the

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mind body while it fares maybe they've

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been getting away with it for far too

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long we'll see another thing that struck

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me this week but you're visiting the

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United States and looking at the TV news

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are the measles outbreak which seems to

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have started in Disneyland of all places

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is making the news and one of the points

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being made is that once the United

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States was

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sidered measles free and i guess the

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work of the anti-vaxxers over years is

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really starting to show now with

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outbreaks of measles people coming in

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from other countries to the United

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States who have measles unvaccinated

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kids running around it's it's

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astonishing measles whooping cough

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what's next we've been fighting the

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anti-vaxxers for many years on the

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skeptic zone and the Australian skeptics

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as you know I don't want to say that

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we're not making any progress because we

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really are we really are but the

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opposition is mobilized their effective

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unfortunately so we just have to keep on

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fighting and its people like dr. Reggie

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Joe alabaster Heidi Robertson who are

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really doing their bit to fight these

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these peddlers of disease and some of

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them really are peddlers of the disease

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they want children to get sick they want

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children to have measles and

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whooping-cough and all these other

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horrible diseases next week we're going

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to have an update on the Tenpenny tour

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or lack thereof Australia the last thing

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I've heard is it looks like the tour has

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been canceled due to pressure from the

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forces of reason but we'll see what

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happens in the coming week and Joe

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alabaster should be able to give us a

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little update next week well that's the

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rant over for now I'm going to run

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upstairs grab that lovely root beer and

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ice out of the fridge because it's a

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warm day well I'm doing that I hope you

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and joining me on the line all the way

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from Australia well imagine that it's

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catan Georgie hello Irish it how is it

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over there in Australia it's absurdly

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hot I I walked outside and my arms melt

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it all and now I have no arms that's

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what I can actually do for the benefit

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of our listeners we're skyping at the

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moment and you're right you have no arms

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I can see now it's ironic because I've

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come all the way here to California to

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what I assumed would be a lovely crisp

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winter only to find that there are

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flowers blooming and I'm walking around

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in a t-shirt I don't know what's going

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on I'm glad you could give me some time

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today because we're talking about things

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warming up we're talking about the

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environment one of your great areas of

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interest is renewable energy which sort

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of ties in rather nicely wind farms this

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sort of thing can you tell me a bit

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about your background and what you're

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doing at the moment yes I did a science

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degree and that was actually focusing on

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neuro and in psychology and after I

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finished I didn't really know what to do

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with myself so ended up in the renewable

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energy industry doing data analysis and

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I did data analysis for about two years

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and now I've ended up doing research and

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communications for wind energy company

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called infant energy but yeah I've been

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I've been a science loving skeptic my

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whole life and it's really fun to apply

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that to the industry in which I work and

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was it last year or the year before you

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actually gave a really great talk to a

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Sydney skeptics dinner meeting about a

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topic which I find really interesting

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because it will get to this as you

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pointed out in your talk this is hardly

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a new topic and we're talking about what

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is it renewable energy sickness or wind

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turbine sickness or what's the

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expression the name for that phenomenon

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was coined in 2009 by actually an

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American pediatrician

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and they and she called it wind turbine

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syndrome syndrome right but I mean it

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gets called different things all the

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time like it's just it's kind of just a

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catch-all term for a bunch of generic

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symptoms experienced by people who are

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within 10 to 30 kilometers of any wind

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farms of any size anywhere in the world

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so it's not really is precise definition

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its prey port and how does this syndrome

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manifest itself the attribution within

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the theory within kind of the the

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construct of the theory is that it comes

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about due to inaudible noise so so not

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sounds that you consciously perceive

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that an invisible inaudible kind of it's

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everywhere at the same time and it's

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really low frequency noise so it's below

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the threshold that our ears can detect

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and they call it infrasound I mean

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that's the technical name for it and

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it's below 20 Hertz which is really

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ridiculously low for you to hear that it

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has to be really really loud so if you

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ever like wound down the car window you

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know when you're in a highway to get

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that kind of like repetitive thumping

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noise that's actually mean in the

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infrasonic range but it's just so loud

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that you can you can perceive it so when

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I say it's not really this it's not

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really able to be perceived it is but it

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has to be stupidly loud yeah okay so

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normally the deadly situations with wind

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farms especially you can't hear it I

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mean if you're close to a wind turbine

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on the wind farms I haven't been what

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noise would you expect to hear basically

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you're a couple things if the turbulence

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shutting down or starting up you can

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hear a bit of like mechanical whirring

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and stuff like that from inside there

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inside the hub when it's just going

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normally what you hear is kind of a very

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sort of like gentle whooshing noise as

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it goes past the tower and that's

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actually when the blade goes past the

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tower the air compresses rum and it just

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kind of makes it like this but you you

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can kind of look it up online you know

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people there's a lot of people who have

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gone to win farms expecting like this

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cacophony of insane like painful death

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Orchestra coming from coming from the

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turbines what you just get is like this

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from four minutes it's pretty quiet

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basically and once you start heading

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away for

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winter by milvia down the road not a far

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distance I imagine you simply wouldn't

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hear anything at all yeah we did this a

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couple of days ago with some guesser at

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the wind farm that they wanted to hear

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the sound of the wind farm from 500

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meters away the one I mentioned before

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winter months in drive is meant to be

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active you know between 10 and 30

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kilometers which is pretty huge yeah 500

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meters away we couldn't perceive the

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noise there was this cow I think it was

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sick or something but it was just going

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nuts as well so we're even masking the

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noise it's a well-made you have G maybe

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the cows got the winter by the signal

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but actually that's it you know we can

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edit that bit out because we don't want

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people to know that the cows are getting

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mix interface we better keep that with

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we better get better keep that be quite

272
00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:46,640
so basically speaking when you're close

273
00:11:50,020 --> 00:11:47,930
to one of these things you'll hear

274
00:11:51,880 --> 00:11:50,030
something yeah you move away and then

275
00:11:53,830 --> 00:11:51,890
it's simply whatever sound is generated

276
00:11:55,990 --> 00:11:53,840
just drops below the human threshold but

277
00:11:57,490 --> 00:11:56,000
basically most of the noise that you get

278
00:11:58,870 --> 00:11:57,500
for a mechanical noise and that

279
00:12:00,370 --> 00:11:58,880
whooshing noise almost always gets

280
00:12:01,990 --> 00:12:00,380
drowned out by the wind itself the wind

281
00:12:03,490 --> 00:12:02,000
is quite noisy particularly when it

282
00:12:05,860 --> 00:12:03,500
collides with something so like a

283
00:12:08,200 --> 00:12:05,870
building or a tree and generally people

284
00:12:10,810 --> 00:12:08,210
tend to live in buildings or they live

285
00:12:13,180 --> 00:12:10,820
near trees so the noise that most people

286
00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:13,190
get in your wind farms is from trees and

287
00:12:17,470 --> 00:12:15,530
and the atmosphere colliding with your

288
00:12:19,090 --> 00:12:17,480
house which would you like what you hear

289
00:12:21,820 --> 00:12:19,100
regardless that's why when you're

290
00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:21,830
testing a wind farm you have to have

291
00:12:25,840 --> 00:12:24,170
what's called on-off testing so when

292
00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:25,850
when they're commissioned the government

293
00:12:28,630 --> 00:12:27,530
says basically you have to test the

294
00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:28,640
noise of your wind farm because they

295
00:12:31,930 --> 00:12:29,810
want to make sure that you're in within

296
00:12:33,250 --> 00:12:31,940
regulation it's kind of it's got some

297
00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:33,260
good scientific principles behind it in

298
00:12:36,640 --> 00:12:34,850
that there's a control there's a time

299
00:12:38,980 --> 00:12:36,650
period in which you switch the wind farm

300
00:12:41,380 --> 00:12:38,990
off and you go let's measure that

301
00:12:42,730 --> 00:12:41,390
background noise and then you switch the

302
00:12:44,110 --> 00:12:42,740
wind farm back on and you go here what's

303
00:12:45,660 --> 00:12:44,120
the difference you subtract the two and

304
00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:45,670
you and that's how you determine the

305
00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:48,290
noise output of the wing farm right I

306
00:12:52,270 --> 00:12:50,210
must admit when I first heard about this

307
00:12:54,460 --> 00:12:52,280
sort of thing it did strike me as odd

308
00:12:55,510 --> 00:12:54,470
because you'd think great wind farms

309
00:12:58,090 --> 00:12:55,520
doing something for the environment

310
00:13:01,030 --> 00:12:58,100
clean energy all the rest of it there

311
00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:01,040
are so many people railing against what

312
00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:02,810
we might call more traditional forms of

313
00:13:06,249 --> 00:13:05,090
energy and probably justly so oil and

314
00:13:08,199 --> 00:13:06,259
coal and all that sort of thing

315
00:13:10,150 --> 00:13:08,209
but they get people Rayleigh against

316
00:13:12,309 --> 00:13:10,160
wind farms most fascinating things I

317
00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:12,319
just I learned from you a year or so

318
00:13:16,059 --> 00:13:13,970
back when you gave a talk was this sort

319
00:13:18,309 --> 00:13:16,069
of resistance to this sort of new

320
00:13:20,409 --> 00:13:18,319
technology goes back quite a kind of way

321
00:13:22,869 --> 00:13:20,419
doesn't it it's it really it goes like a

322
00:13:24,789 --> 00:13:22,879
very long way I was actually professor

323
00:13:26,439 --> 00:13:24,799
Simon Chapman Sydney University brought

324
00:13:28,359 --> 00:13:26,449
this to my attention there's a paper in

325
00:13:30,369 --> 00:13:28,369
the British Medical Journal from the i

326
00:13:32,199 --> 00:13:30,379
think it was actually the 1800s if not

327
00:13:35,949 --> 00:13:32,209
after um actually don't remember when

328
00:13:37,449 --> 00:13:35,959
the telephone I should know that huh but

329
00:13:39,309 --> 00:13:37,459
whatever that was invented there was a

330
00:13:41,799 --> 00:13:39,319
letter there was a full letter in there

331
00:13:44,619 --> 00:13:41,809
in the bmj about the health risks of

332
00:13:47,199 --> 00:13:44,629
landline telephones well and the list of

333
00:13:48,489 --> 00:13:47,209
symptoms is really one of the most

334
00:13:50,949 --> 00:13:48,499
fascinating things I've read because

335
00:13:53,799 --> 00:13:50,959
it's almost identical to many of these

336
00:13:55,569 --> 00:13:53,809
contemporary syndromes yeah but we hear

337
00:13:57,279 --> 00:13:55,579
about that it's a very similar list

338
00:13:59,979 --> 00:13:57,289
every single time it's it's something

339
00:14:02,919 --> 00:13:59,989
it's it's nausea headaches sleeplessness

340
00:14:06,309 --> 00:14:02,929
anxiety kind of like this just feeling

341
00:14:08,109 --> 00:14:06,319
of panic along with this kind of really

342
00:14:09,879 --> 00:14:08,119
visceral fear that you just get in the

343
00:14:11,799 --> 00:14:09,889
pit of your stomach and that translates

344
00:14:13,029 --> 00:14:11,809
into a lot of actual real symptoms you

345
00:14:15,039 --> 00:14:13,039
know you know when you when you're

346
00:14:17,199 --> 00:14:15,049
anxious like that you do tend to get

347
00:14:19,150 --> 00:14:17,209
more sick that's the roles will be well

348
00:14:21,869 --> 00:14:19,160
established kind of outcome of being

349
00:14:24,220 --> 00:14:21,879
worried about that like a prevalence

350
00:14:26,049 --> 00:14:24,230
piece of technology that's new you all

351
00:14:27,849 --> 00:14:26,059
the time something new and something

352
00:14:28,989 --> 00:14:27,859
you're not used to maybe well that's

353
00:14:30,340 --> 00:14:28,999
adventure the telephone that's

354
00:14:32,710 --> 00:14:30,350
interesting I didn't know that but let's

355
00:14:34,749 --> 00:14:32,720
advance of to not that long ago when

356
00:14:35,889 --> 00:14:34,759
cell phone mobile phone towers started

357
00:14:37,269 --> 00:14:35,899
popping up and this is a very

358
00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:37,279
interesting point that you pointed out

359
00:14:42,039 --> 00:14:39,410
as well it has all the same features

360
00:14:44,079 --> 00:14:42,049
really um and that's kind of ubiquity

361
00:14:45,609 --> 00:14:44,089
it's kind of it's everywhere right and

362
00:14:47,559 --> 00:14:45,619
they're really visible so when telegraph

363
00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:47,569
wires went up they were really visible

364
00:14:51,099 --> 00:14:49,850
to and now we're getting those you seen

365
00:14:53,439 --> 00:14:51,109
their cell phone towers on top of

366
00:14:55,689 --> 00:14:53,449
buildings with the white you know sort

367
00:14:57,279 --> 00:14:55,699
of transmission array they often have to

368
00:14:59,049 --> 00:14:57,289
put them on top of residential buildings

369
00:15:00,819 --> 00:14:59,059
when I was actually researching that

370
00:15:02,710 --> 00:15:00,829
talk I found some interesting articles

371
00:15:04,779 --> 00:15:02,720
about it and I tweeted them just as kind

372
00:15:06,039 --> 00:15:04,789
of like hey check out this interesting

373
00:15:07,869 --> 00:15:06,049
you know isn't it interesting that

374
00:15:10,659 --> 00:15:07,879
people are worried about this and when I

375
00:15:12,519 --> 00:15:10,669
tweeted a bunch of active groups started

376
00:15:14,140 --> 00:15:12,529
responding to me saying thank you for

377
00:15:16,300 --> 00:15:14,150
sharing our story you know we

378
00:15:18,190 --> 00:15:16,310
this is a planned telstra tower on top

379
00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:18,200
of our building we appreciate that

380
00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:19,850
you're you know raising awareness of

381
00:15:25,570 --> 00:15:21,170
that that's like I think you've got the

382
00:15:27,040 --> 00:15:25,580
wrong idea I think I actually did have a

383
00:15:28,990 --> 00:15:27,050
good chat with them because you know

384
00:15:31,090 --> 00:15:29,000
it's interesting to kind of get an idea

385
00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:31,100
of where they're coming from why are

386
00:15:35,290 --> 00:15:33,170
they scared and what kind of drilling

387
00:15:38,020 --> 00:15:35,300
down to what their fears are and much of

388
00:15:39,460 --> 00:15:38,030
that fear comes from having no control

389
00:15:41,140 --> 00:15:39,470
over the development of these things I

390
00:15:42,640 --> 00:15:41,150
reckon if you did a survey with those

391
00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:42,650
people grew worried about landline

392
00:15:46,990 --> 00:15:43,970
telephones you know hundreds of years

393
00:15:48,250 --> 00:15:47,000
ago or 100 years ago you would probably

394
00:15:49,870 --> 00:15:48,260
get the same thing they're like well I'm

395
00:15:51,070 --> 00:15:49,880
angry and I'm freaked out because I

396
00:15:53,380 --> 00:15:51,080
can't do anything about it and I'm

397
00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:53,390
peeved about that and I'm gonna get work

398
00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:54,890
gives them something if they're not

399
00:15:59,140 --> 00:15:57,050
feeling well or people some people are

400
00:16:01,930 --> 00:15:59,150
prone to I don't know hypochondria I

401
00:16:03,850 --> 00:16:01,940
guess it gives them a um a reason when

402
00:16:04,900 --> 00:16:03,860
someone is sick and they don't know

403
00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:04,910
what's causing it and they go to a

404
00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:07,610
doctor in the doctors like uninor we've

405
00:16:11,020 --> 00:16:09,410
got no idea and then someone else comes

406
00:16:12,730 --> 00:16:11,030
along and says well I know I know what's

407
00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:12,740
wrong with you is it's this particular

408
00:16:17,350 --> 00:16:14,810
thing that's near you yeah it's quite a

409
00:16:18,700 --> 00:16:17,360
relief i can probably like it so there

410
00:16:22,660 --> 00:16:18,710
was some news that came out this week

411
00:16:24,700 --> 00:16:22,670
which are basically it was like a 490

412
00:16:26,350 --> 00:16:24,710
page report and it's a really

413
00:16:28,270 --> 00:16:26,360
fascinating development with this whole

414
00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:28,280
winged turbine syndrome thing because

415
00:16:33,460 --> 00:16:31,610
it's a study that involved six residents

416
00:16:34,690 --> 00:16:33,470
from three separate households at a wing

417
00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:34,700
phone called the cape bridgewater wind

418
00:16:38,500 --> 00:16:36,410
farm we sort of same stuff like this

419
00:16:40,240 --> 00:16:38,510
before where they'll survey a select

420
00:16:42,100 --> 00:16:40,250
really small number of like

421
00:16:44,140 --> 00:16:42,110
non-representative residents and then

422
00:16:46,630 --> 00:16:44,150
take those results to be representative

423
00:16:48,100 --> 00:16:46,640
of the wider population which as you and

424
00:16:49,750 --> 00:16:48,110
I know that's not a not a particularly

425
00:16:52,810 --> 00:16:49,760
good scientific method right because

426
00:16:54,550 --> 00:16:52,820
it's it says its selection bias but the

427
00:16:55,930 --> 00:16:54,560
unique thing about this study is that it

428
00:16:57,700 --> 00:16:55,940
was actually commissioned by the wind

429
00:16:59,020 --> 00:16:57,710
farm operator and so what they did was

430
00:17:00,690 --> 00:16:59,030
they said to these residents in

431
00:17:03,340 --> 00:17:00,700
complaining for a really long time and

432
00:17:05,680 --> 00:17:03,350
then commissioned acoustic studies from

433
00:17:07,180 --> 00:17:05,690
you know just basically a randomly

434
00:17:08,890 --> 00:17:07,190
chosen acoustic consulting and they

435
00:17:10,329 --> 00:17:08,900
could never find anything right now just

436
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:10,339
like look that we've studied there's so

437
00:17:13,390 --> 00:17:11,810
many times and there's nothing we can't

438
00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:13,400
find anything different about this wind

439
00:17:17,199 --> 00:17:15,290
farm yet the residents keep complaining

440
00:17:18,820 --> 00:17:17,209
residents you guys choose your

441
00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:18,830
acoustician we're not get it because you

442
00:17:21,550 --> 00:17:20,330
obviously you want it like you're not

443
00:17:23,740 --> 00:17:21,560
happy with our choice to do kiss did

444
00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:23,750
buku station so you guys choose that too

445
00:17:28,179 --> 00:17:25,850
who does the study and

446
00:17:31,720 --> 00:17:28,189
did but the manager the study has

447
00:17:34,120 --> 00:17:31,730
basically done work for anti-wind groups

448
00:17:36,669 --> 00:17:34,130
before oh yeah this study that he did is

449
00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:36,679
in my opinion a pretty poor study but

450
00:17:39,730 --> 00:17:38,330
the most stunning there's two really

451
00:17:41,140 --> 00:17:39,740
important stories here one is that he

452
00:17:43,090 --> 00:17:41,150
did it really didn't do very good

453
00:17:45,070 --> 00:17:43,100
science but the second really important

454
00:17:47,380 --> 00:17:45,080
thing is that a letter was written by

455
00:17:48,850 --> 00:17:47,390
those residents right and they published

456
00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:48,860
it on the website of this group called

457
00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:50,570
corporate foundation now the Water

458
00:17:55,720 --> 00:17:53,450
Foundation are an organization who are

459
00:17:57,220 --> 00:17:55,730
basically dedicated to propagating the

460
00:17:59,020 --> 00:17:57,230
wind turbine syndrome theory to

461
00:18:00,370 --> 00:17:59,030
communities near wind farms right there

462
00:18:02,200 --> 00:18:00,380
often describing the media as an anti

463
00:18:03,970 --> 00:18:02,210
win group and I would pretty much concur

464
00:18:06,100 --> 00:18:03,980
with that in that they focus on

465
00:18:07,870 --> 00:18:06,110
basically regulating we climbed out of

466
00:18:09,580 --> 00:18:07,880
existence right they published this

467
00:18:11,740 --> 00:18:09,590
statement from these residents who were

468
00:18:12,970 --> 00:18:11,750
in this study it's probably the most

469
00:18:16,299 --> 00:18:12,980
interesting part of it because the

470
00:18:19,510 --> 00:18:16,309
residents say we we are relieved we're

471
00:18:21,190 --> 00:18:19,520
happy because this study tells us what

472
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:21,200
we saw all along the wind farms were

473
00:18:24,039 --> 00:18:22,730
causing our symptoms so I should I

474
00:18:25,870 --> 00:18:24,049
didn't mention what the results of the

475
00:18:28,210 --> 00:18:25,880
study were what he did was he got the

476
00:18:29,169 --> 00:18:28,220
residents to fill in Diaries oh yeah I /

477
00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:29,179
measurements from the wind farm at the

478
00:18:34,240 --> 00:18:32,330
same time measured noise and he measured

479
00:18:37,360 --> 00:18:34,250
something that he invented for the study

480
00:18:39,610 --> 00:18:37,370
called sensation sensation is what we

481
00:18:41,409 --> 00:18:39,620
were just mentioning before with the

482
00:18:43,930 --> 00:18:41,419
symptoms experienced with telephone

483
00:18:45,970 --> 00:18:43,940
lines decades ago and mobile phone tower

484
00:18:48,760 --> 00:18:45,980
as well as those stuff it's nausea its

485
00:18:50,860 --> 00:18:48,770
headaches ankush pneus it's some unease

486
00:18:52,750 --> 00:18:50,870
like you know in your stomach that sort

487
00:18:54,430 --> 00:18:52,760
of thing yeah he heralded it is like you

488
00:18:56,230 --> 00:18:54,440
know this is a new type of acoustic

489
00:18:58,630 --> 00:18:56,240
study it has never been done before and

490
00:19:00,220 --> 00:18:58,640
it has it has been basically he found

491
00:19:02,049 --> 00:19:00,230
that there was no correlation between

492
00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:02,059
noise reports there was no correlation

493
00:19:08,350 --> 00:19:04,970
between low frequency noise and noise

494
00:19:12,100 --> 00:19:08,360
reports but what he did find there was a

495
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:12,110
slight increase in severity in sensation

496
00:19:19,539 --> 00:19:15,890
reports during periods of higher power

497
00:19:21,039 --> 00:19:19,549
output but not noise output which is I

498
00:19:22,360 --> 00:19:21,049
won't go too far into it because we're

499
00:19:24,730 --> 00:19:22,370
going to have the talk of it basically

500
00:19:26,950 --> 00:19:24,740
my first instinct on reading that was

501
00:19:28,180 --> 00:19:26,960
war what do you mean by correlation is

502
00:19:29,799 --> 00:19:28,190
that a statistically significant

503
00:19:32,740 --> 00:19:29,809
correlation what kind of measures did

504
00:19:34,899 --> 00:19:32,750
you use and there's a quote in an

505
00:19:36,789 --> 00:19:34,909
article that just came out yesterday or

506
00:19:38,140 --> 00:19:36,799
the day before where he just said oh

507
00:19:39,310 --> 00:19:38,150
look what I did was

508
00:19:41,410 --> 00:19:39,320
look at label to when they were

509
00:19:43,780 --> 00:19:41,420
reporting impacts and I just work

510
00:19:47,530 --> 00:19:43,790
backwards from there and found noise

511
00:19:50,950 --> 00:19:47,540
output to correlated with that it's just

512
00:19:52,330 --> 00:19:50,960
like that's not great science lavoie and

513
00:19:53,770 --> 00:19:52,340
he says that an article right like I'm

514
00:19:55,510 --> 00:19:53,780
not I'm not paraphrasing that you know

515
00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:55,520
this is um this isn't an article in The

516
00:19:58,210 --> 00:19:56,570
Australian that was published on

517
00:20:00,550 --> 00:19:58,220
Thursday by their environmentally

518
00:20:03,100 --> 00:20:00,560
redditor Graeme Lloyd and he also says

519
00:20:04,900 --> 00:20:03,110
well sure they reported sensations when

520
00:20:08,200 --> 00:20:04,910
the wind turbines were off but the wind

521
00:20:10,510 --> 00:20:08,210
turbines were vibrating due to the wind

522
00:20:12,970 --> 00:20:10,520
and that's why they were reporting

523
00:20:15,220 --> 00:20:12,980
sensations in their Diaries during the

524
00:20:16,420 --> 00:20:15,230
shutdown period which again right like

525
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:16,430
you think about you think about the

526
00:20:19,540 --> 00:20:17,810
scientific method there and you think

527
00:20:22,270 --> 00:20:19,550
about what a normal scientific study

528
00:20:25,000 --> 00:20:22,280
would do they would say well that seems

529
00:20:26,770 --> 00:20:25,010
to be a confounder because perhaps all

530
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:26,780
the recitation reports before migrating

531
00:20:30,190 --> 00:20:28,970
went to the buttons or suddenly

532
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:30,200
something Elementary in something else

533
00:20:34,150 --> 00:20:32,090
we think we're measuring a correlation

534
00:20:36,880 --> 00:20:34,160
between wind farm noise and these diary

535
00:20:40,150 --> 00:20:36,890
reports but it's actually it's something

536
00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:40,160
completely different right so again

537
00:20:43,780 --> 00:20:42,170
there's a lot there's a lot wrong with a

538
00:20:45,490 --> 00:20:43,790
study found that but those are probably

539
00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:45,500
the two key parts but the residents

540
00:20:49,420 --> 00:20:47,330
residents looked at this study and they

541
00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:49,430
were like thank God you know like we've

542
00:20:53,470 --> 00:20:51,410
been told that we're making it up and

543
00:20:55,900 --> 00:20:53,480
with the toll that were liars and you

544
00:20:58,570 --> 00:20:55,910
know finally we get something that that

545
00:21:00,880 --> 00:20:58,580
tells us that our sickness our health

546
00:21:02,770 --> 00:21:00,890
problems are caused by this thing and

547
00:21:05,170 --> 00:21:02,780
with them we're happy what they say in

548
00:21:07,540 --> 00:21:05,180
this letter is like thank you you know

549
00:21:10,390 --> 00:21:07,550
for taking the time for spending like

550
00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:10,400
hours and weeks and days just talking to

551
00:21:15,370 --> 00:21:13,490
us right and when I was reading that the

552
00:21:18,820 --> 00:21:15,380
thing that immediately sprang to my mind

553
00:21:20,950 --> 00:21:18,830
was homeopathy because the thing I I've

554
00:21:23,530 --> 00:21:20,960
sort of noticed with homeopathy is

555
00:21:25,360 --> 00:21:23,540
people who who undergo and actually a

556
00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:25,370
close relative of mine is currently

557
00:21:29,890 --> 00:21:28,010
taking homeopathic treatments and I was

558
00:21:32,500 --> 00:21:29,900
talking to her about what is it that

559
00:21:34,450 --> 00:21:32,510
attracts you to it and she's like it's

560
00:21:35,710 --> 00:21:34,460
that they take the time to listen to me

561
00:21:37,180 --> 00:21:35,720
and they don't say that I'm that I'm

562
00:21:38,500 --> 00:21:37,190
wrong they just they just kind of like

563
00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:38,510
sit there and they listen and they kind

564
00:21:42,220 --> 00:21:39,890
of tell me that I'm right you know yeah

565
00:21:45,010 --> 00:21:42,230
I'll be that my belief in homeopathy

566
00:21:46,660 --> 00:21:45,020
isn't misplaced they say you've made the

567
00:21:48,100 --> 00:21:46,670
right choice here you're not you aren't

568
00:21:49,670 --> 00:21:48,110
deluded you're not you're not wrong

569
00:21:51,590 --> 00:21:49,680
about this they basically

570
00:21:53,030 --> 00:21:51,600
hang with them right so so this is what

571
00:21:54,860 --> 00:21:53,040
really stands out to me with this recent

572
00:21:57,170 --> 00:21:54,870
study is that what happened is someone

573
00:22:00,110 --> 00:21:57,180
found found a group of people with a

574
00:22:01,820 --> 00:22:00,120
belief and reinforce that belief oh yeah

575
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:01,830
better than own content that they

576
00:22:06,950 --> 00:22:04,050
reinforce that belief with not very good

577
00:22:08,510 --> 00:22:06,960
science yeah well I mean but these

578
00:22:11,120 --> 00:22:08,520
people really didn't need convincing

579
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:11,130
before we've come across this sort of

580
00:22:14,690 --> 00:22:13,050
people it's like homeopathy they don't

581
00:22:17,360 --> 00:22:14,700
need convincing they know what's right

582
00:22:19,130 --> 00:22:17,370
but when someone confirms what they

583
00:22:22,060 --> 00:22:19,140
already knows to be true then they're

584
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:22,070
more set in it we also look at things

585
00:22:26,390 --> 00:22:24,810
along the similar lines here we have the

586
00:22:27,980 --> 00:22:26,400
telephone the worries with that we've

587
00:22:31,700 --> 00:22:27,990
got the wind turbines or cell phones

588
00:22:33,110 --> 00:22:31,710
that smart meters smart meters to and

589
00:22:35,390 --> 00:22:33,120
you've discovered that this is similar

590
00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:35,400
would now you have a name for this I

591
00:22:40,490 --> 00:22:37,770
called it everything syndrome yeah and

592
00:22:41,870 --> 00:22:40,500
it's actually intend to basically put

593
00:22:43,730 --> 00:22:41,880
all this into a paper or something and

594
00:22:46,490 --> 00:22:43,740
then don't know publish it somewhere if

595
00:22:49,070 --> 00:22:46,500
I can I think smart meters are unique in

596
00:22:51,350 --> 00:22:49,080
that just the raw passion behind it is

597
00:22:52,610 --> 00:22:51,360
is unparalleled Wyoming people are

598
00:22:54,140 --> 00:22:52,620
passionate about the wind turbine

599
00:22:55,370 --> 00:22:54,150
syndrome thing as well and they were

600
00:22:58,700 --> 00:22:55,380
passionate about the cell phone thing

601
00:23:01,880 --> 00:22:58,710
too but I don't know why but the smart

602
00:23:03,950 --> 00:23:01,890
leader thing just gets people furious in

603
00:23:05,570 --> 00:23:03,960
an unmatched way there are some YouTube

604
00:23:09,260 --> 00:23:05,580
videos of protests that are held outside

605
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:09,270
on local the offices of parliamentarians

606
00:23:15,260 --> 00:23:12,930
in Victoria and the the emotion behind

607
00:23:18,260 --> 00:23:15,270
some of these protests is is really

608
00:23:21,740 --> 00:23:18,270
really strong and I'm actually a bit

609
00:23:24,230 --> 00:23:21,750
baffled as to why it's different for

610
00:23:25,850 --> 00:23:24,240
smart meters and I suppose my guess is

611
00:23:28,130 --> 00:23:25,860
simply that it's closer to people's

612
00:23:29,990 --> 00:23:28,140
homes right like I think that's it yeah

613
00:23:32,150 --> 00:23:30,000
I think that's it it's in it's in their

614
00:23:34,820 --> 00:23:32,160
home and they've been told this is

615
00:23:36,410 --> 00:23:34,830
making them sick yeah i can i can

616
00:23:37,970 --> 00:23:36,420
understand some people would get

617
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:37,980
incredibly passionate about it

618
00:23:41,330 --> 00:23:39,090
especially if they think they're getting

619
00:23:43,370 --> 00:23:41,340
sick or the family's getting sick yeah

620
00:23:45,190 --> 00:23:43,380
and it's just it's a similar thing right

621
00:23:47,450 --> 00:23:45,200
so so if it's a government-mandated

622
00:23:49,700 --> 00:23:47,460
rollout so if the government says we

623
00:23:50,930 --> 00:23:49,710
want wind turbines across our lands and

624
00:23:52,370 --> 00:23:50,940
there and then the government and you

625
00:23:53,900 --> 00:23:52,380
know they can't have introduced asking

626
00:23:56,480 --> 00:23:53,910
to do that then there's going to be more

627
00:23:57,740 --> 00:23:56,490
chance of people strangely like does it

628
00:23:59,240 --> 00:23:57,750
seem like I could like an intuitive

629
00:24:01,590 --> 00:23:59,250
thing that somehow there's a link that

630
00:24:03,900 --> 00:24:01,600
where people are more likely to

631
00:24:05,580 --> 00:24:03,910
feel ill because you know that they're

632
00:24:07,620 --> 00:24:05,590
in tribute to the to the presence of

633
00:24:09,570 --> 00:24:07,630
that thing in Victoria the rollout of

634
00:24:11,549 --> 00:24:09,580
smart me smart meters was mandatory and

635
00:24:15,659 --> 00:24:11,559
in New South Wales is going to be

636
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:15,669
optional and my guess is that you'll get

637
00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:18,490
a much lower rate of people complaining

638
00:24:22,169 --> 00:24:21,130
about smart near syndrome basically in

639
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:22,179
New South Wales than you will in

640
00:24:25,230 --> 00:24:24,250
Victoria and that's kind of why I one of

641
00:24:26,669 --> 00:24:25,240
you know it like put something together

642
00:24:29,610 --> 00:24:26,679
and get it in writing like this is my

643
00:24:31,890 --> 00:24:29,620
guess you know I bet I won't get the

644
00:24:33,419 --> 00:24:31,900
same type of groups in the Victorian

645
00:24:35,970 --> 00:24:33,429
election there was a group called people

646
00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:35,980
power no smart leaders and they when I

647
00:24:39,570 --> 00:24:37,450
think they I camera now how many votes

648
00:24:40,620 --> 00:24:39,580
they got it wasn't a huge number i don't

649
00:24:42,299 --> 00:24:40,630
think they got a seat in the Senate

650
00:24:44,130 --> 00:24:42,309
they're on their website what they were

651
00:24:47,669 --> 00:24:44,140
basically saying as part of their policy

652
00:24:49,919 --> 00:24:47,679
is every single human being who lives in

653
00:24:52,320 --> 00:24:49,929
a residence in Victoria should have the

654
00:24:55,350 --> 00:24:52,330
right to veto any technology within a

655
00:24:56,730 --> 00:24:55,360
reasonable distance of their home and

656
00:24:58,560 --> 00:24:56,740
that's anything right like that wasn't

657
00:25:00,690 --> 00:24:58,570
limited to smile so someone wants to

658
00:25:03,390 --> 00:25:00,700
build I don't know a bus stop with an

659
00:25:05,070 --> 00:25:03,400
LCD display that would fall under the

660
00:25:07,320 --> 00:25:05,080
heading of technology so you could say

661
00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:07,330
not yeah but I bet they burglarized

662
00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:09,010
themselves by talking on their cell

663
00:25:12,330 --> 00:25:10,570
phones though is that I think there's a

664
00:25:15,270 --> 00:25:12,340
caveat on their website but like this is

665
00:25:19,230 --> 00:25:15,280
all done through ethernet cables no not

666
00:25:21,450 --> 00:25:19,240
wife but I actually really relish you

667
00:25:22,740 --> 00:25:21,460
know taking the taking time to just read

668
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:22,750
what they're saying and listen to the

669
00:25:25,980 --> 00:25:24,250
kind of things that they put online the

670
00:25:28,169 --> 00:25:25,990
videos because it gives us a really

671
00:25:30,750 --> 00:25:28,179
really important insight into how people

672
00:25:33,149 --> 00:25:30,760
react technology well the new energy

673
00:25:35,430 --> 00:25:33,159
push it's not an easy road I you know

674
00:25:36,750 --> 00:25:35,440
when I was a kid growing up in the 70s I

675
00:25:39,299 --> 00:25:36,760
remember seeing bumper stickers that

676
00:25:41,310 --> 00:25:39,309
would say solar energy the way of the

677
00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:41,320
future well I'm in the future I'm still

678
00:25:45,180 --> 00:25:43,690
waiting for it I know it'll come and I

679
00:25:47,190 --> 00:25:45,190
know I know it'll be a good thing it's

680
00:25:48,450 --> 00:25:47,200
just taking a long time listener qatar

681
00:25:50,549 --> 00:25:48,460
where can people find out more about

682
00:25:53,430 --> 00:25:50,559
what you're up to I've got a blog that

683
00:25:56,279 --> 00:25:53,440
is just called some air or much-loved

684
00:26:00,120 --> 00:25:56,289
blogspot com value ah I don't know why I

685
00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:00,130
chose a German name is known action they

686
00:26:04,830 --> 00:26:02,770
want to say we had missiles in Germany

687
00:26:06,690 --> 00:26:04,840
it's all right it's possible okay um

688
00:26:10,710 --> 00:26:06,700
it's probably a lot better to just go to

689
00:26:12,810 --> 00:26:10,720
my Twitter feed which is catan j 0 and x

690
00:26:14,850 --> 00:26:12,820
j 0 and or you can just go

691
00:26:16,860 --> 00:26:14,860
my name that's usually better because

692
00:26:18,419 --> 00:26:16,870
Google will tell you everything alright

693
00:26:20,610 --> 00:26:18,429
so those people out there who were

694
00:26:22,649 --> 00:26:20,620
afraid of the user depth and Wi-Fi and

695
00:26:25,139 --> 00:26:22,659
smart meters and wind turbines and

696
00:26:26,999 --> 00:26:25,149
telephones and heaven knows one run to

697
00:26:28,409 --> 00:26:27,009
the blog and have a look welcome home

698
00:26:31,379 --> 00:26:28,419
thank you for taking the time out today

699
00:26:48,119 --> 00:26:31,389
in hot stinking Sydney Australia from

700
00:26:52,289 --> 00:26:48,129
security ah summer in Australia the sand

701
00:26:55,019 --> 00:26:52,299
the sea the surf the heat the skepticism

702
00:26:57,090 --> 00:26:55,029
yes the great ocean road skeptics from

703
00:26:58,919 --> 00:26:57,100
the far south coast of Australia are

704
00:27:01,289 --> 00:26:58,929
bringing back the Surf Coast summer

705
00:27:04,590 --> 00:27:01,299
skeptic amp for the fourth year in a row

706
00:27:06,749 --> 00:27:04,600
this year this is a grassroots skeptical

707
00:27:08,730 --> 00:27:06,759
event in a small community hall in

708
00:27:11,009 --> 00:27:08,740
aireys inlet one of the most gorgeous

709
00:27:13,730 --> 00:27:11,019
seaside villages on the great ocean road

710
00:27:16,169 --> 00:27:13,740
so even got a lighthouse on everything

711
00:27:18,240 --> 00:27:16,179
this is a free event and lunch is

712
00:27:19,860 --> 00:27:18,250
provided it's an easy day trip for

713
00:27:21,899 --> 00:27:19,870
Melbourne or you can make the most of

714
00:27:23,759 --> 00:27:21,909
the beautiful location and spend the

715
00:27:26,610 --> 00:27:23,769
whole weekend soaking up the natural

716
00:27:28,409 --> 00:27:26,620
beauty and world famous beaches you can

717
00:27:30,419 --> 00:27:28,419
join us for a relaxing dinner with other

718
00:27:33,749 --> 00:27:30,429
skeptics at the local pub when the

719
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:33,759
skeptic camp is done details can be

720
00:27:38,730 --> 00:27:36,250
found on our Eventbrite booking page or

721
00:27:41,490 --> 00:27:38,740
you can find out listing on skeptic

722
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:41,500
groups of Victoria Facebook page if you

723
00:27:44,249 --> 00:27:42,850
have a talk you'd like to give or any

724
00:27:46,649 --> 00:27:44,259
other questions just use the contact

725
00:27:48,360 --> 00:27:46,659
organizer button on the booking page to

726
00:27:50,850 --> 00:27:48,370
send an email and we'll be back in touch

727
00:27:53,940 --> 00:27:50,860
with you in previous years we've had

728
00:27:56,100 --> 00:27:53,950
group discussions videos and talks on

729
00:27:59,580 --> 00:27:56,110
topics ranging from alternative medicine

730
00:28:02,039 --> 00:27:59,590
to local UFO mysteries so why not wander

731
00:28:05,159 --> 00:28:02,049
over to our Eventbrite booking page at

732
00:28:07,259 --> 00:28:05,169
Surf Coast summer skeptic amp for and

733
00:28:08,610 --> 00:28:07,269
let us know you're coming we look

734
00:28:10,259 --> 00:28:08,620
forward to welcoming you on the

735
00:28:16,660 --> 00:28:10,269
twenty-eighth of februari in aireys

736
00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:19,070
be reasonable is a podcast in the

737
00:28:23,510 --> 00:28:21,330
merseyside skeptics society hosted by

738
00:28:25,310 --> 00:28:23,520
Michael Marshall in each monthly

739
00:28:27,410 --> 00:28:25,320
interview we'll examine belief from

740
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:27,420
outside of the mainstream exploring how

741
00:28:30,770 --> 00:28:29,010
those views are constructed and what

742
00:28:33,890 --> 00:28:30,780
evidence people feel supports their case

743
00:28:36,470 --> 00:28:33,900
in the latest episode I speak with dr.

744
00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:36,480
Leo rebello a homeopath an author who

745
00:28:40,880 --> 00:28:39,090
argues that HIV doesn't exist and that

746
00:28:44,180 --> 00:28:40,890
aids should be treated with homeopathy

747
00:28:48,950 --> 00:28:44,190
and yoga so when I say we treat AIDS

748
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:48,960
patient it is a combination of diet yoga

749
00:28:57,740 --> 00:28:53,490
homeopathy herbs psychological medicine

750
00:28:59,920 --> 00:28:57,750
dance therapy counseling all that goes

751
00:29:02,420 --> 00:28:59,930
into it we don't stop at giving

752
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:02,430
antiretroviral antiretroviral and entity

753
00:29:07,730 --> 00:29:05,610
provider which are known carcinogen hey

754
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:07,740
what leo has to say as well as icing to

755
00:29:12,920 --> 00:29:09,810
back issues the show by visiting

756
00:29:15,140 --> 00:29:12,930
merseyside skeptics to org UK forward

757
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:15,150
slash podcasts or searching be

758
00:29:23,990 --> 00:29:21,810
reasonable on iTunes the skeptic zone is

759
00:29:28,490 --> 00:29:24,000
brought to you by dr. Bob's trivia quiz

760
00:29:32,980 --> 00:29:28,500
visit dr. Bob's quiz wordpress.com and

761
00:29:37,940 --> 00:29:35,840
welcome to a week in science from RI oz

762
00:29:41,390 --> 00:29:37,950
bringing you the science he needs to

763
00:29:43,610 --> 00:29:41,400
know 2014 was a massive year for science

764
00:29:45,770 --> 00:29:43,620
so let's look back at the year's top 5

765
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:45,780
science stories with a little help from

766
00:29:55,070 --> 00:29:53,010
our friends at the oz smc at number 5 we

767
00:29:57,980 --> 00:29:55,080
had a sneak peek into the origins of

768
00:30:02,120 --> 00:29:57,990
vertebrate sex and they probably did it

769
00:30:04,220 --> 00:30:02,130
sideways 385 million year old fossilized

770
00:30:06,440 --> 00:30:04,230
fish called auntie arcs were found to

771
00:30:08,480 --> 00:30:06,450
copulate in what could best be described

772
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:08,490
as a bizarre square dance like

773
00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:11,370
displaying the male had bony claspers

774
00:30:16,100 --> 00:30:13,650
that transferred sperm which clamped

775
00:30:19,250 --> 00:30:16,110
onto small paired bones on the female

776
00:30:22,000 --> 00:30:19,260
which helped dock the male organ in a

777
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:22,010
sideways position

778
00:30:29,060 --> 00:30:25,530
the largest dinosaur ever discovered is

779
00:30:32,450 --> 00:30:29,070
our number four story for 2014 the

780
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:32,460
fossils of a titanosaur sauropod or long

781
00:30:38,090 --> 00:30:35,370
neck dinosaur were found in argentina by

782
00:30:40,490 --> 00:30:38,100
a farmer the ultra mega dinosaur lived

783
00:30:42,710 --> 00:30:40,500
100 million years ago its head could

784
00:30:44,780 --> 00:30:42,720
have been lifted to around 20 meters

785
00:30:47,180 --> 00:30:44,790
above the ground and the whole beast

786
00:30:51,890 --> 00:30:47,190
would have been 40 metres long clocking

787
00:30:57,530 --> 00:30:51,900
in at 77 tons as much as 14 African

788
00:30:59,600 --> 00:30:57,540
elephants 2014 may go down as the year

789
00:31:02,420 --> 00:30:59,610
in which major countries started taking

790
00:31:04,580 --> 00:31:02,430
climate change seriously in October and

791
00:31:07,610 --> 00:31:04,590
EU agreement aimed to cut carbon

792
00:31:11,870 --> 00:31:07,620
emissions by forty percent of 1990s

793
00:31:14,300 --> 00:31:11,880
levels by the year 2030 and in November

794
00:31:16,940 --> 00:31:14,310
both the US and China the world's two

795
00:31:18,770 --> 00:31:16,950
largest carbon emitters agreed to take

796
00:31:21,430 --> 00:31:18,780
action on controlling their carbon

797
00:31:25,340 --> 00:31:21,440
outputs with the u.s. pledging to cut

798
00:31:30,380 --> 00:31:25,350
2005 carbon emission levels by 26 to 28

799
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:30,390
percent within the next 10 years at

800
00:31:35,210 --> 00:31:32,130
number 2 is the landing of the fill a

801
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:35,220
probe on a speeding comet this 10 year

802
00:31:40,490 --> 00:31:37,890
long project involved a half billion

803
00:31:43,460 --> 00:31:40,500
kilometer race to have the probe and a

804
00:31:45,590 --> 00:31:43,470
comet meet in the vastness of space the

805
00:31:48,110 --> 00:31:45,600
probe successfully landed on the comet

806
00:31:52,190 --> 00:31:48,120
and detected organic molecules before

807
00:31:55,610 --> 00:31:52,200
its batteries died and the number one

808
00:31:58,670 --> 00:31:55,620
science story for 2014 is the Ebola

809
00:32:02,360 --> 00:31:58,680
outbreak in West Africa the outbreak has

810
00:32:05,570 --> 00:32:02,370
infected over 17,000 people of whom over

811
00:32:07,340 --> 00:32:05,580
6,000 have died the Ebola virus causes

812
00:32:09,700 --> 00:32:07,350
impaired kidney and liver function

813
00:32:12,290 --> 00:32:09,710
diarrhea and dehydration and

814
00:32:14,210 --> 00:32:12,300
uncontrollable bleeding the United

815
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:14,220
Nations countries around the world and

816
00:32:18,560 --> 00:32:16,530
non-government organizations are still

817
00:32:21,530 --> 00:32:18,570
working to contain the outbreak and

818
00:32:24,890 --> 00:32:21,540
treat the infected that's our top side

819
00:32:31,659 --> 00:32:24,900
stories for 2014 I'm poor Willis and

820
00:32:36,710 --> 00:32:34,669
hi this is column Rhine from Cork

821
00:32:39,470 --> 00:32:36,720
skeptics in the Republic of Ireland here

822
00:32:41,720 --> 00:32:39,480
our next event skeptics in the castle

823
00:32:43,669 --> 00:32:41,730
features Michael Marshall recounting his

824
00:32:46,399 --> 00:32:43,679
ongoing adventures in the world of

825
00:32:48,590 --> 00:32:46,409
pseudoscience Michael needs no

826
00:32:50,989 --> 00:32:48,600
introduction to skeptics he is the

827
00:32:53,180 --> 00:32:50,999
organizer of the QED conference in the

828
00:32:55,249 --> 00:32:53,190
UK as well as the vice president of the

829
00:32:56,779 --> 00:32:55,259
Merseyside skeptics society and the

830
00:32:59,149 --> 00:32:56,789
project director of the good thinking

831
00:33:01,460 --> 00:32:59,159
Society irregularly speaks with

832
00:33:04,070 --> 00:33:01,470
proponents of pseudoscience for the be

833
00:33:07,279 --> 00:33:04,080
reasonable podcast as well as co-hosting

834
00:33:10,039 --> 00:33:07,289
the skeptics with a que podcast his talk

835
00:33:12,619 --> 00:33:10,049
begins at eight pm on Thursday the fifth

836
00:33:15,710 --> 00:33:12,629
of februari the venue is Black Rock

837
00:33:17,899 --> 00:33:15,720
castle Observatory near Cork City it's

838
00:33:23,570 --> 00:33:17,909
free to attend and all are welcome we

839
00:33:33,190 --> 00:33:23,580
look forward to seeing you there here's

840
00:33:37,899 --> 00:33:35,680
as you know the venue is the chatswood

841
00:33:39,460 --> 00:33:37,909
club Richard but um I didn't expect the

842
00:33:41,049 --> 00:33:39,470
line to be this far out the door well

843
00:33:43,299 --> 00:33:41,059
we're walking and walking and walking

844
00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:43,309
and walking and there are still people

845
00:33:47,019 --> 00:33:44,690
queued up to get inside this quite

846
00:33:48,759 --> 00:33:47,029
extraordinary man here actually um hello

847
00:33:50,830 --> 00:33:48,769
I can see you at the very end of the

848
00:33:53,529 --> 00:33:50,840
line here how's it going good what's

849
00:33:55,180 --> 00:33:53,539
your name red and dark catering and

850
00:33:58,299 --> 00:33:55,190
you're here for the whole conference or

851
00:34:00,460 --> 00:33:58,309
just for tonight's show oh yeah I'm

852
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:00,470
former okay so obviously have you been

853
00:34:03,430 --> 00:34:01,850
skeptics for long watch your skeptical

854
00:34:05,789 --> 00:34:03,440
history others Richard Saunders by the

855
00:34:08,319 --> 00:34:05,799
way he's my day he's my he's my dad oh

856
00:34:12,579 --> 00:34:08,329
just listen start listening to the S to

857
00:34:15,460 --> 00:34:12,589
you about two years ago and yeah so

858
00:34:17,139 --> 00:34:15,470
we're mainly here to see them okay did

859
00:34:20,589 --> 00:34:17,149
you write any questions down for them

860
00:34:22,419 --> 00:34:20,599
and send them on to George no no I let

861
00:34:24,339 --> 00:34:22,429
everyone else do that okay and what's

862
00:34:25,569 --> 00:34:24,349
your specialist area of skepticism is

863
00:34:28,470 --> 00:34:25,579
there something that really annoys you

864
00:34:30,609 --> 00:34:28,480
that you think I'm glad I'm a skeptic I

865
00:34:33,609 --> 00:34:30,619
health issues probably because you know

866
00:34:34,750 --> 00:34:33,619
having a young daughter going to just

867
00:34:36,490 --> 00:34:34,760
making sure we're getting all the right

868
00:34:38,919 --> 00:34:36,500
information around that sort of thing so

869
00:34:42,720 --> 00:34:38,929
yeah have you ran into any anti vex

870
00:34:46,720 --> 00:34:42,730
parents not yeah well I happen not

871
00:34:48,849 --> 00:34:46,730
really but when the reluctant Max's yes

872
00:34:50,889 --> 00:34:48,859
what about the other one that seems to

873
00:34:52,569 --> 00:34:50,899
be quite right it's those amber teething

874
00:34:54,430 --> 00:34:52,579
rings if you have you met anyone who's

875
00:34:55,899 --> 00:34:54,440
really into them because I don't think

876
00:34:59,200 --> 00:34:55,909
there's any science to back that up I'm

877
00:35:01,480 --> 00:34:59,210
a bit does that and also the takes what

878
00:35:04,510 --> 00:35:01,490
she taking pill form oh there plus

879
00:35:05,740 --> 00:35:04,520
center oh really and what's that

880
00:35:07,930 --> 00:35:05,750
supposed to just make you generally

881
00:35:10,540 --> 00:35:07,940
healthier is it makes you happier mix

882
00:35:13,390 --> 00:35:10,550
you're less likely to put the postnatal

883
00:35:14,650 --> 00:35:13,400
depression okay oh yeah all right for

884
00:35:16,059 --> 00:35:14,660
the eve of the amber teething ring so

885
00:35:17,589 --> 00:35:16,069
that whole thing seems and particularly

886
00:35:22,780 --> 00:35:17,599
since I usually made out of plastic too

887
00:35:24,309 --> 00:35:22,790
yeah yeah it's a bit on actually we've

888
00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:24,319
found that the skeptic zone listener

889
00:35:27,910 --> 00:35:26,210
women we knew they were there somewhere

890
00:35:29,109 --> 00:35:27,920
what's your name it's me I'm Catherine

891
00:35:31,450 --> 00:35:29,119
hi Catherine how long you been to

892
00:35:33,490 --> 00:35:31,460
skeptics only stuff ah quite a while

893
00:35:36,329 --> 00:35:33,500
back Ishod remember vaguely watching a

894
00:35:38,279 --> 00:35:36,339
video one right back at the start

895
00:35:40,109 --> 00:35:38,289
yeah I'm not sure I stayed with it that

896
00:35:41,670 --> 00:35:40,119
whole time but I kind of came back the

897
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:41,680
quite a while yet and we went to the

898
00:35:45,479 --> 00:35:43,450
ride cemetery and we did a bit of a

899
00:35:47,999 --> 00:35:45,489
ghost too were there how did you find

900
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:48,009
that that was really interesting i was

901
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:49,690
thinking about whether i would go or not

902
00:35:53,249 --> 00:35:51,249
and even though I'm yeah I'm pretty

903
00:35:55,289 --> 00:35:53,259
skeptical bad all these things there's

904
00:35:57,749 --> 00:35:55,299
still something about it and I don't

905
00:35:59,819 --> 00:35:57,759
like gotta forget the poopy enemy in

906
00:36:01,440 --> 00:35:59,829
fact listening back to it when that girl

907
00:36:03,329 --> 00:36:01,450
just said that there was a six-year-old

908
00:36:04,650 --> 00:36:03,339
kid next to her holding her hand I had

909
00:36:05,910 --> 00:36:04,660
to stop listening to my own story I

910
00:36:07,769 --> 00:36:05,920
couldn't even listen to it I think he

911
00:36:09,479 --> 00:36:07,779
walked away at that fine I did I made an

912
00:36:10,680 --> 00:36:09,489
excuse about having to go poo and fall

913
00:36:11,910 --> 00:36:10,690
down or something like that I just made

914
00:36:14,249 --> 00:36:11,920
any excuse and got out here because

915
00:36:17,099 --> 00:36:14,259
because it really rattled me yeah yeah

916
00:36:18,839 --> 00:36:17,109
would be I mean it's all just this weird

917
00:36:20,489 --> 00:36:18,849
well there's three options she's either

918
00:36:23,309 --> 00:36:20,499
experiencing something of the paranormal

919
00:36:25,200 --> 00:36:23,319
which I couldn't witness and was a

920
00:36:26,670 --> 00:36:25,210
pretty awesome thing she was either

921
00:36:28,410 --> 00:36:26,680
making it up or she was suffering the

922
00:36:30,450 --> 00:36:28,420
delusion all through it none of those

923
00:36:32,789 --> 00:36:30,460
three things am I prepared for what

924
00:36:35,370 --> 00:36:32,799
might be all three well yeah oh yes oh

925
00:36:36,630 --> 00:36:35,380
yeah but it was pretty serious stuff to

926
00:36:38,549 --> 00:36:36,640
be there in the middle of the night

927
00:36:40,799 --> 00:36:38,559
wasn't it Richard it was indeed but I'm

928
00:36:42,059 --> 00:36:40,809
glad we do oh yeah I don't know if I'll

929
00:36:43,529 --> 00:36:42,069
do it again in a hurry and I wouldn't

930
00:36:44,880 --> 00:36:43,539
play the Ouija board Richard played the

931
00:36:47,969 --> 00:36:44,890
Ouija board and I wouldn't talk to him

932
00:36:50,039 --> 00:36:47,979
did it no no in silent yeah I do that

933
00:36:51,989 --> 00:36:50,049
thing as a kid where you at it like at a

934
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:51,999
slumber party we put two fingers out of

935
00:36:55,979 --> 00:36:53,890
the people under someone to try and lift

936
00:36:57,209 --> 00:36:55,989
them up and did it work I should not

937
00:36:58,769 --> 00:36:57,219
remember but I'm assuming it did in

938
00:37:00,690 --> 00:36:58,779
otherwise I would have remembered okay

939
00:37:03,029 --> 00:37:00,700
because I I have heard of people doing

940
00:37:04,680 --> 00:37:03,039
that and it working what pains how many

941
00:37:05,700 --> 00:37:04,690
people you have I suppose yeah that's

942
00:37:06,779 --> 00:37:05,710
true and what are you looking forward to

943
00:37:08,500 --> 00:37:06,789
this weekend as part of the big

944
00:37:10,990 --> 00:37:08,510
skeptical weekend

945
00:37:14,350 --> 00:37:11,000
a bit of a break from the family left

946
00:37:15,730 --> 00:37:14,360
the kids at home and just everything

947
00:37:18,070 --> 00:37:15,740
just meeting meeting all the people that

948
00:37:19,810 --> 00:37:18,080
I listen to you so much I've got a whole

949
00:37:21,340 --> 00:37:19,820
list of questions for people and I've

950
00:37:23,380 --> 00:37:21,350
broken it bat down by who I'm going to

951
00:37:24,970 --> 00:37:23,390
ask well they're all in here and you

952
00:37:26,110 --> 00:37:24,980
better sign in so the line doesn't get

953
00:37:27,580 --> 00:37:26,120
any longer and if you've got any

954
00:37:31,450 --> 00:37:27,590
questions for me please come and ask me

955
00:37:33,400 --> 00:37:31,460
will do pretty good yeah it's going to

956
00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:33,410
have a chat about what's going on look

957
00:37:36,610 --> 00:37:35,450
it's a relatively quiet oasis of

958
00:37:39,220 --> 00:37:36,620
skepticism over here in the corner

959
00:37:41,590 --> 00:37:39,230
who've we got I got Terry Kelly the vice

960
00:37:42,970 --> 00:37:41,600
president of the Victorian skeptic now

961
00:37:44,020 --> 00:37:42,980
you'd be having a big relaxed one with

962
00:37:46,420 --> 00:37:44,030
your feet up because you've got nothing

963
00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:46,430
to do with this none of the or now

964
00:37:49,450 --> 00:37:47,810
organizing this side but we're getting

965
00:37:50,710 --> 00:37:49,460
bit nervous because we might have to do

966
00:37:53,230 --> 00:37:50,720
it again in a couple years you never

967
00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:53,240
know what was the thing that sort of was

968
00:37:56,860 --> 00:37:55,370
a difficult at the last minute for a

969
00:37:58,150 --> 00:37:56,870
conference like this just everyone who

970
00:37:59,650 --> 00:37:58,160
has one there's always something weird

971
00:38:02,080 --> 00:37:59,660
think it happens at the last minute and

972
00:38:04,240 --> 00:38:02,090
you got to run around like a nut yeah we

973
00:38:06,589 --> 00:38:04,250
had problems with accommodation for some

974
00:38:09,589 --> 00:38:06,599
of the guest speakers

975
00:38:12,229 --> 00:38:09,599
for once we didn't actually go to the

976
00:38:15,499 --> 00:38:12,239
hotels and two or three of our star

977
00:38:16,759 --> 00:38:15,509
performers were accommodated in

978
00:38:18,769 --> 00:38:16,769
accommodation didn't have air

979
00:38:19,789 --> 00:38:18,779
conditioning and it was hot right so

980
00:38:22,749 --> 00:38:19,799
that was that happened right in the

981
00:38:24,559 --> 00:38:22,759
middle of the convention that yeah look

982
00:38:26,210 --> 00:38:24,569
registration was a problem for us

983
00:38:28,549 --> 00:38:26,220
because we did the registration on the

984
00:38:30,319 --> 00:38:28,559
Friday night so getting people in the

985
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:30,329
door well there's a problem here tonight

986
00:38:33,979 --> 00:38:32,249
but it's not a skeptical problem as the

987
00:38:35,660 --> 00:38:33,989
club's the problem it there's only two

988
00:38:37,400 --> 00:38:35,670
books people can time to get in we're

989
00:38:39,170 --> 00:38:37,410
just saying we were just talking that

990
00:38:41,900 --> 00:38:39,180
this is it's really fabulous at the so

991
00:38:44,150 --> 00:38:41,910
many people it's a little bit sad that

992
00:38:45,739 --> 00:38:44,160
it's so I'd to get a drink we're the

993
00:38:48,529 --> 00:38:45,749
clinickers two people here a lot of

994
00:38:50,479 --> 00:38:48,539
thirsty people yeah but it's fabulous it

995
00:38:52,460 --> 00:38:50,489
like there are people catching up with

996
00:38:54,319 --> 00:38:52,470
old friends yes and there are people

997
00:38:56,630 --> 00:38:54,329
meeting new people and I suppose the

998
00:38:58,700 --> 00:38:56,640
more drinks they have the more new

999
00:39:01,069 --> 00:38:58,710
people they'll meet which is why it's a

1000
00:39:02,870 --> 00:39:01,079
shame it's so hard to get a drink that's

1001
00:39:04,430 --> 00:39:02,880
pretty true and one of my favorite

1002
00:39:06,319 --> 00:39:04,440
teachers from the Victorian system here

1003
00:39:07,579 --> 00:39:06,329
how are you sir thanks man oh good how

1004
00:39:08,989 --> 00:39:07,589
are you pretty good could you let us

1005
00:39:11,059 --> 00:39:08,999
know who you are again and which school

1006
00:39:12,380 --> 00:39:11,069
e right now same school I'm Adam

1007
00:39:13,729 --> 00:39:12,390
valeting every week still a McKinnon

1008
00:39:15,289 --> 00:39:13,739
Secondary College in me over that's

1009
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:15,299
right and how's your skeptical group

1010
00:39:19,640 --> 00:39:17,130
they're going skeptical groves going

1011
00:39:21,079 --> 00:39:19,650
really well passing through a lot of

1012
00:39:22,819 --> 00:39:21,089
different students coming in you know a

1013
00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:22,829
lot of new faces turning up at the start

1014
00:39:25,789 --> 00:39:24,210
of every year which is really nice to

1015
00:39:27,019 --> 00:39:25,799
see and what sort of subjects that

1016
00:39:28,099 --> 00:39:27,029
they've got interested in lately is

1017
00:39:29,150 --> 00:39:28,109
there something they've been interested

1018
00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:29,160
in it's different from the regular

1019
00:39:32,690 --> 00:39:31,410
movement and we've been spending a bit

1020
00:39:34,219 --> 00:39:32,700
of time lately actually talking about

1021
00:39:37,489 --> 00:39:34,229
the differences between science and

1022
00:39:39,200 --> 00:39:37,499
pseudoscience which I I found just is a

1023
00:39:40,670 --> 00:39:39,210
very short little image on the internet

1024
00:39:42,950 --> 00:39:40,680
that had a few key points and I thought

1025
00:39:44,900 --> 00:39:42,960
I okay this will entertain the kids for

1026
00:39:46,549 --> 00:39:44,910
about an hour at lunchtime and two

1027
00:39:48,349 --> 00:39:46,559
months later we are still talking about

1028
00:39:49,970 --> 00:39:48,359
that exact same thing

1029
00:39:52,460 --> 00:39:49,980
and what is the simple definition that

1030
00:39:54,410 --> 00:39:52,470
you gave them I don't think I had a

1031
00:39:56,509 --> 00:39:54,420
simple definition for it was more of a

1032
00:39:57,950 --> 00:39:56,519
if it does these things it's probably

1033
00:40:01,069 --> 00:39:57,960
pseudoscience if it does these things

1034
00:40:02,809 --> 00:40:01,079
it's probably science and have many of

1035
00:40:04,099 --> 00:40:02,819
these students gone on to be in the

1036
00:40:07,190 --> 00:40:04,109
young skeptics group of Melbourne and

1037
00:40:09,349 --> 00:40:07,200
that sort of thing I think so yeah a few

1038
00:40:10,970 --> 00:40:09,359
of the students are sort of in the more

1039
00:40:12,529 --> 00:40:10,980
senior years of life I know there are a

1040
00:40:15,559 --> 00:40:12,539
couple definitely you have gone to join

1041
00:40:18,349 --> 00:40:15,569
on a Melbourne Uni and join I think this

1042
00:40:21,410 --> 00:40:18,359
I forgot the name rational it's a

1043
00:40:23,479 --> 00:40:21,420
rational society okay so if you my kids

1044
00:40:25,190 --> 00:40:23,489
have gone on to do that and on to bigger

1045
00:40:27,799 --> 00:40:25,200
and better things which is always nice

1046
00:40:29,089 --> 00:40:27,809
to see leave me in the dust and lots of

1047
00:40:30,529 --> 00:40:29,099
thing that's still excites you about it

1048
00:40:32,180 --> 00:40:30,539
aside and being a teacher it's a lot of

1049
00:40:34,190 --> 00:40:32,190
the same same how do you make it fresh

1050
00:40:35,839 --> 00:40:34,200
this off all the time having a really

1051
00:40:37,579 --> 00:40:35,849
faulty memory so every time I do

1052
00:40:40,069 --> 00:40:37,589
everything it feels new to me goldfish

1053
00:40:41,299 --> 00:40:40,079
memory yeah exactly right but I'm used

1054
00:40:42,349 --> 00:40:41,309
to that as a maths teacher every

1055
00:40:43,430 --> 00:40:42,359
classroom you know the kids have

1056
00:40:45,769 --> 00:40:43,440
forgotten what I told him the day before

1057
00:40:47,660 --> 00:40:45,779
so I could probably just do the exact

1058
00:40:48,979 --> 00:40:47,670
same talk every single fortnight and the

1059
00:40:50,299 --> 00:40:48,989
kids to get the same amount out of it

1060
00:40:51,979 --> 00:40:50,309
what are you looking forward to this

1061
00:40:53,089 --> 00:40:51,989
week Adam is there one speaker or one

1062
00:40:55,579 --> 00:40:53,099
topic you really want to get your teeth

1063
00:40:57,890 --> 00:40:55,589
into I'm looking forward to having a

1064
00:40:59,299 --> 00:40:57,900
weekend off I'm just being able to put

1065
00:41:00,920 --> 00:40:59,309
my feet up and not have to worry about

1066
00:41:02,210 --> 00:41:00,930
anything for a while to be honest but

1067
00:41:04,220 --> 00:41:02,220
now there are a lot of things I'm

1068
00:41:07,370 --> 00:41:04,230
looking forward to hearing a dick smith

1069
00:41:10,020 --> 00:41:07,380
speak seeing the skeptics guide

1070
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:10,030
presentations there in the individual

1071
00:41:14,250 --> 00:41:11,890
one doctor novellas at the end of it I

1072
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:14,260
think I'm speaking just before Stephen

1073
00:41:18,180 --> 00:41:16,330
novella so I don't know if that's going

1074
00:41:19,890 --> 00:41:18,190
to make it easy for him or worse being a

1075
00:41:22,020 --> 00:41:19,900
lot of people looking forward to hearing

1076
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:22,030
adam van langenberg speak well there you

1077
00:41:27,630 --> 00:41:24,130
go yeah yeah thank you at least at least

1078
00:41:29,099 --> 00:41:27,640
one Terry thanks buster students on a

1079
00:41:30,810 --> 00:41:29,109
bowler did you look at the the

1080
00:41:33,030 --> 00:41:30,820
skepticism an angle to a bolo and that

1081
00:41:35,070 --> 00:41:33,040
was going around yeah we talked about it

1082
00:41:36,810 --> 00:41:35,080
just a little bit more about the you

1083
00:41:38,339 --> 00:41:36,820
know the representation of it the media

1084
00:41:39,720 --> 00:41:38,349
and the difference between just

1085
00:41:41,670 --> 00:41:39,730
believing everything you see on the TV

1086
00:41:45,420 --> 00:41:41,680
and how can you go and do some actual

1087
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:45,430
research into it yourself look you have

1088
00:41:48,630 --> 00:41:46,690
a good time and I hope your speech goes

1089
00:41:50,460 --> 00:41:48,640
well yeah thanks very much for you think

1090
00:41:51,420 --> 00:41:50,470
standing ovation that's our look if

1091
00:41:54,300 --> 00:41:51,430
there's anything less I'll be

1092
00:41:55,470 --> 00:41:54,310
disappointed I think he's someone I

1093
00:41:58,290 --> 00:41:55,480
haven't seen for a while who've we got

1094
00:42:00,150 --> 00:41:58,300
here very well livers my name and what

1095
00:42:03,089 --> 00:42:00,160
are you up to today Barry how many of

1096
00:42:05,010 --> 00:42:03,099
these have you been to now well I'm here

1097
00:42:06,390 --> 00:42:05,020
as a volunteer I was running the

1098
00:42:08,820 --> 00:42:06,400
skeptics for a number of years and I

1099
00:42:11,490 --> 00:42:08,830
attended 27 of these on the trot and I

1100
00:42:13,589 --> 00:42:11,500
retired about five years ago and decided

1101
00:42:14,940 --> 00:42:13,599
just to drop in occasionally but they

1102
00:42:17,400 --> 00:42:14,950
they needed somebody to give a bit of a

1103
00:42:19,230 --> 00:42:17,410
hand and I live locally so I'm giving

1104
00:42:21,089 --> 00:42:19,240
help yeah I hadn't seen you around for a

1105
00:42:23,130 --> 00:42:21,099
little while Barry and last time I spoke

1106
00:42:25,470 --> 00:42:23,140
to you talked about your early history

1107
00:42:27,450 --> 00:42:25,480
with the skeptics movement and how you

1108
00:42:29,820 --> 00:42:27,460
thought that sometimes the interest in

1109
00:42:32,010 --> 00:42:29,830
paranormal divided upon gender lines

1110
00:42:33,570 --> 00:42:32,020
sometimes like guys tend to go for UFOs

1111
00:42:36,630 --> 00:42:33,580
while women tend to go for the more

1112
00:42:39,839 --> 00:42:36,640
spiritual that was my observation over

1113
00:42:42,900 --> 00:42:39,849
the years yeah and I guess that's that's

1114
00:42:45,180 --> 00:42:42,910
similar in real life to the sort of more

1115
00:42:47,700 --> 00:42:45,190
technical things men tend to be more

1116
00:42:51,300 --> 00:42:47,710
interesting women tend to be Morrison in

1117
00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:51,310
the in the emotional things I suppose

1118
00:42:55,380 --> 00:42:53,650
now i'll probably get castigated for

1119
00:42:56,700 --> 00:42:55,390
that but you know i don't mean that in a

1120
00:42:59,849 --> 00:42:56,710
negative way it's just the way people

1121
00:43:01,680 --> 00:42:59,859
are now is there some new wow that's

1122
00:43:03,270 --> 00:43:01,690
come around that you haven't seen before

1123
00:43:05,870 --> 00:43:03,280
because you've just about seen at all is

1124
00:43:08,070 --> 00:43:05,880
there something new you've seen

1125
00:43:09,450 --> 00:43:08,080
late-night look whoever said there's

1126
00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:09,460
nothing new Under the Sun I think i

1127
00:43:14,730 --> 00:43:11,130
mighta been Shakespeare was quite right

1128
00:43:17,820 --> 00:43:14,740
but having been the Bible but yeah look

1129
00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:17,830
they all they come and go and maybe they

1130
00:43:23,099 --> 00:43:19,690
slightly different guises some of these

1131
00:43:26,190 --> 00:43:23,109
things come in with the by and large the

1132
00:43:27,510 --> 00:43:26,200
same old fundamental beliefs keep coming

1133
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:27,520
back they get knocked on the head for a

1134
00:43:33,089 --> 00:43:29,050
wild and like I'm back again you can

1135
00:43:34,770 --> 00:43:33,099
guarantee it I expect possibly spoon

1136
00:43:37,140 --> 00:43:34,780
bending might be due for a come back any

1137
00:43:38,790 --> 00:43:37,150
time do you think it all gets back to

1138
00:43:40,380 --> 00:43:38,800
people wanting something for nothing

1139
00:43:41,670 --> 00:43:40,390
they want to lose weight without doing

1140
00:43:43,050 --> 00:43:41,680
anything they want to be smart or

1141
00:43:45,089 --> 00:43:43,060
without going and doing any more

1142
00:43:46,950 --> 00:43:45,099
learning that sort of thing no question

1143
00:43:48,780 --> 00:43:46,960
about that yeah sure I mean they yeah

1144
00:43:51,210 --> 00:43:48,790
it's a quite understandable thing I mean

1145
00:43:54,250 --> 00:43:51,220
I think as a species we're a fairly all

1146
00:43:56,200 --> 00:43:54,260
we'd like to be idle and

1147
00:43:58,420 --> 00:43:56,210
those of us are fortunate enough to live

1148
00:43:59,980 --> 00:43:58,430
in societies like ours get a lot more

1149
00:44:01,780 --> 00:43:59,990
idleness than perhaps if we were living

1150
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:01,790
in Africa or somewhere like that where

1151
00:44:07,360 --> 00:44:03,770
you have to actually work pretty hard to

1152
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:07,370
stay alive so and we get a custom lip

1153
00:44:11,410 --> 00:44:08,930
and then we would start wanting more and

1154
00:44:12,880 --> 00:44:11,420
more things for nothing so you've been

1155
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:12,890
well and truly retired for a while now

1156
00:44:21,100 --> 00:44:19,490
how do you fill up your days wow I I do

1157
00:44:22,990 --> 00:44:21,110
a lot of reading catching up with the

1158
00:44:24,460 --> 00:44:23,000
reading I just didn't have time to there

1159
00:44:25,990 --> 00:44:24,470
before I got a lot of skeptical books

1160
00:44:28,870 --> 00:44:26,000
I'm reading and I'm ready a lot more

1161
00:44:32,290 --> 00:44:28,880
fiction these days they used to and I've

1162
00:44:34,390 --> 00:44:32,300
got a couple of grand sons one of whom

1163
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:34,400
is just about just stopped doing a PhD

1164
00:44:38,980 --> 00:44:36,170
and one of them was just parts it past

1165
00:44:40,900 --> 00:44:38,990
these HSC so they're not little kids but

1166
00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:40,910
I still take as much looking after from

1167
00:44:44,550 --> 00:44:42,650
our grandfather like driving them he had

1168
00:44:46,990 --> 00:44:44,560
driving them but that doesn't change

1169
00:44:48,730 --> 00:44:47,000
what's your advice to them when it comes

1170
00:44:51,190 --> 00:44:48,740
to thinking critically that what's the

1171
00:44:52,870 --> 00:44:51,200
first step you should take well I always

1172
00:44:56,050 --> 00:44:52,880
tell them never believe anything you

1173
00:44:58,570 --> 00:44:56,060
hear without a reason I'm if somebody

1174
00:44:59,860 --> 00:44:58,580
and make sure the reason isn't that you

1175
00:45:01,660 --> 00:44:59,870
actually want to believe it make sure

1176
00:45:04,630 --> 00:45:01,670
there's some good reason for believing

1177
00:45:05,920 --> 00:45:04,640
what claims we don't wake and and I

1178
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:05,930
think that stands people in good stead

1179
00:45:11,710 --> 00:45:09,410
anywhere these boys are pretty smart

1180
00:45:16,150 --> 00:45:11,720
pretty level-headed but like all young

1181
00:45:17,710 --> 00:45:16,160
men they fall for the zeitgeist of the

1182
00:45:19,000 --> 00:45:17,720
age if you like it I tend to believe in

1183
00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:19,010
some ratbag things that I wouldn't

1184
00:45:22,330 --> 00:45:20,690
believe in but then with their age I

1185
00:45:25,390 --> 00:45:22,340
used to believe another threat bag thing

1186
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:25,400
so that's why it goes thanks Barry enjoy

1187
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:27,410
your this would be your 28th convention

1188
00:45:31,690 --> 00:45:29,570
you'd been to then live yeah I think so

1189
00:45:33,580 --> 00:45:31,700
I i really haven't kept careful it was a

1190
00:45:35,710 --> 00:45:33,590
round about that yeah yeah i think this

1191
00:45:37,720 --> 00:45:35,720
is about the 30th and i've been to all

1192
00:45:40,720 --> 00:45:37,730
except the cup also will you go nuts

1193
00:45:43,570 --> 00:45:40,730
here today Barry I will I will do thank

1194
00:45:45,010 --> 00:45:43,580
you very much I'm here with a fan of the

1195
00:45:46,780 --> 00:45:45,020
Skip exam what's your name sir Enrique

1196
00:45:50,020 --> 00:45:46,790
and how long you been listening to the

1197
00:45:51,850 --> 00:45:50,030
skeptic zone for 8 to 10 years it's hard

1198
00:45:53,980 --> 00:45:51,860
to tell anymore but it quite a while and

1199
00:45:55,090 --> 00:45:53,990
then what now what is it about a thick

1200
00:45:56,860 --> 00:45:55,100
you're kind of like I guess it's an

1201
00:45:58,630 --> 00:45:56,870
Australian show for start but it's

1202
00:46:00,210 --> 00:45:58,640
Australian it helps me keep up to date

1203
00:46:02,130 --> 00:46:00,220
with what's going on as

1204
00:46:06,300 --> 00:46:02,140
a nicely concentrated resource for

1205
00:46:08,400 --> 00:46:06,310
Australian skeptical things and overall

1206
00:46:10,620 --> 00:46:08,410
just very interesting the format that

1207
00:46:12,839 --> 00:46:10,630
Richards man should put together overall

1208
00:46:14,250 --> 00:46:12,849
I've just had a great time listening to

1209
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:14,260
it yeah what do you think of us going to

1210
00:46:18,690 --> 00:46:16,810
the cemetery the other day I will admit

1211
00:46:20,849 --> 00:46:18,700
I'm a bit behind because I've been

1212
00:46:22,260 --> 00:46:20,859
hooked on a new thing that I'm catching

1213
00:46:23,849 --> 00:46:22,270
up with but then I will catch up I

1214
00:46:25,080 --> 00:46:23,859
promise oh that's okay because the thing

1215
00:46:27,330 --> 00:46:25,090
is they sit there forever so you can

1216
00:46:28,620 --> 00:46:27,340
take your time yes that is one of the

1217
00:46:30,180 --> 00:46:28,630
brilliant things about are you a

1218
00:46:32,070 --> 00:46:30,190
commuter that likes to listen on the way

1219
00:46:34,530 --> 00:46:32,080
to work you're in the shower kind of guy

1220
00:46:37,530 --> 00:46:34,540
before you go to bed when doing the

1221
00:46:39,630 --> 00:46:37,540
dishes mainly and when I'm driving the

1222
00:46:42,540 --> 00:46:39,640
kids aren't in the car okay and head of

1223
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:42,550
the kids feel about it daddy daddy I

1224
00:46:47,190 --> 00:46:43,930
don't like this story turn it off and

1225
00:46:50,040 --> 00:46:47,200
the case you can turn it off on your

1226
00:46:51,570 --> 00:46:50,050
older yeah I try but then they just get

1227
00:46:53,730 --> 00:46:51,580
louder and start playing louder games

1228
00:46:56,070 --> 00:46:53,740
and there's no point so I give up I they

1229
00:46:57,300 --> 00:46:56,080
win oh and what's your favorite kind of

1230
00:46:59,010 --> 00:46:57,310
what do you hate the most what are the

1231
00:47:01,349 --> 00:46:59,020
one we go that damn woo and you shake

1232
00:47:05,609 --> 00:47:01,359
your fist acupuncture because my boss

1233
00:47:07,410 --> 00:47:05,619
has a an acupuncture clinic and I have

1234
00:47:09,450 --> 00:47:07,420
to deal with it at work including her at

1235
00:47:10,770 --> 00:47:09,460
one point say coming up to me with a

1236
00:47:12,750 --> 00:47:10,780
couple of acupuncture needles when I had

1237
00:47:14,880 --> 00:47:12,760
a particularly stuffy nose my reaction

1238
00:47:18,300 --> 00:47:14,890
she thought I was scared of the needles

1239
00:47:20,730 --> 00:47:18,310
mine it was more of just don't want to

1240
00:47:23,839 --> 00:47:20,740
have to deal with this yes it was a very

1241
00:47:26,849 --> 00:47:23,849
uncomfortable and difficult situation

1242
00:47:30,470 --> 00:47:26,859
because she'll say but it's proven and

1243
00:47:32,790 --> 00:47:30,480
you'll go but it's not avoid the subject

1244
00:47:36,240 --> 00:47:32,800
she's one of the two directors of the

1245
00:47:37,950 --> 00:47:36,250
company okay yes well so no yeah bit of

1246
00:47:40,349 --> 00:47:37,960
tact there i can understand thank you

1247
00:47:42,480 --> 00:47:40,359
very much so i love who I work I just

1248
00:47:43,890 --> 00:47:42,490
don't like that one aspect of it it

1249
00:47:45,240 --> 00:47:43,900
makes it very difficult we'll enjoy the

1250
00:47:47,609 --> 00:47:45,250
rest of the conference saying thank you

1251
00:47:49,380 --> 00:47:47,619
very much look I'm here with mr. Marsh

1252
00:47:51,210 --> 00:47:49,390
and he was losing fans at a rate of

1253
00:47:53,099 --> 00:47:51,220
knots last night now mr. Marsh you were

1254
00:47:54,690 --> 00:47:53,109
having a big skeptical discussion about

1255
00:47:56,430 --> 00:47:54,700
television that could have gone horribly

1256
00:47:58,050 --> 00:47:56,440
wrong for your entire career last night

1257
00:48:00,359 --> 00:47:58,060
in chatswood that's true i made some

1258
00:48:02,099 --> 00:48:00,369
appalling nerd four pars because i was

1259
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:02,109
pointing out that i think game of

1260
00:48:07,620 --> 00:48:04,570
thrones is appalling leaning and has no

1261
00:48:09,810 --> 00:48:07,630
characters and the plot does not really

1262
00:48:11,430 --> 00:48:09,820
sir progress so much is kind of plugged

1263
00:48:12,240 --> 00:48:11,440
on and he has no idea where he's going

1264
00:48:14,160 --> 00:48:12,250
and they

1265
00:48:16,170 --> 00:48:14,170
I usually refer to that shows no pants

1266
00:48:17,460 --> 00:48:16,180
monarchs yeah if it was called that I

1267
00:48:18,690 --> 00:48:17,470
could go with it cuz at least its kind

1268
00:48:19,920 --> 00:48:18,700
of putting out there exactly what's all

1269
00:48:21,930 --> 00:48:19,930
about but don't pretend that there's

1270
00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:21,940
this kind of well thought out story arc

1271
00:48:24,180 --> 00:48:23,050
that's coming you've no idea where it's

1272
00:48:26,070 --> 00:48:24,190
gone me this one of milk it and then I

1273
00:48:27,600 --> 00:48:26,080
pointed out that the people who compared

1274
00:48:29,430 --> 00:48:27,610
Breaking Bad to being some Shakespearean

1275
00:48:31,050 --> 00:48:29,440
tragedy is just offensive it is a

1276
00:48:33,060 --> 00:48:31,060
terrible terrible show with

1277
00:48:34,830 --> 00:48:33,070
one-dimensional characters you don't

1278
00:48:36,150 --> 00:48:34,840
have any and I think I lost pretty much

1279
00:48:38,070 --> 00:48:36,160
everyone who's ever listened to any show

1280
00:48:39,990 --> 00:48:38,080
I've ever done around that table then

1281
00:48:41,400 --> 00:48:40,000
cut you any slack and just nod or at

1282
00:48:42,600 --> 00:48:41,410
least would they go straight few throat

1283
00:48:43,650 --> 00:48:42,610
I would say it's not the slack that I

1284
00:48:44,880 --> 00:48:43,660
was worried about them cutting it was

1285
00:48:46,140 --> 00:48:44,890
definitely the throw it that's where I

1286
00:48:47,850 --> 00:48:46,150
was worried about the cutting taking

1287
00:48:49,950 --> 00:48:47,860
place so what were you holding up some

1288
00:48:51,570 --> 00:48:49,960
show like the doctors or emmerdale one

1289
00:48:53,310 --> 00:48:51,580
they are the great products of the UK

1290
00:48:54,900 --> 00:48:53,320
output you know I don't think anybody

1291
00:48:56,310 --> 00:48:54,910
who is listening to this wherever this

1292
00:48:58,440 --> 00:48:56,320
girls will have heard of em adil and

1293
00:48:59,820 --> 00:48:58,450
that is frankly a good thing because

1294
00:49:01,440 --> 00:48:59,830
emma was one of the most appalling

1295
00:49:02,940 --> 00:49:01,450
things we've ever committed one opposed

1296
00:49:05,010 --> 00:49:02,950
most appalling act we've ever committed

1297
00:49:06,690 --> 00:49:05,020
in Britain and we were colonial powers

1298
00:49:07,860 --> 00:49:06,700
you know I'm adele is definitely the top

1299
00:49:09,630 --> 00:49:07,870
of the most appalling things we've ever

1300
00:49:11,250 --> 00:49:09,640
done no hang on wasn't a show that was

1301
00:49:12,630 --> 00:49:11,260
worse than that called Silverado or

1302
00:49:14,820 --> 00:49:12,640
something that was made out of Scotland

1303
00:49:16,770 --> 00:49:14,830
or something in the 90s hello Terrell

1304
00:49:18,480 --> 00:49:16,780
eldorado that's all that's made out why

1305
00:49:21,600 --> 00:49:18,490
do you know this is ourselves in the UK

1306
00:49:24,150 --> 00:49:21,610
in the 90s on a tube and someone said

1307
00:49:26,730 --> 00:49:24,160
Scotland gave that the England

1308
00:49:28,140 --> 00:49:26,740
television with john logie baird us like

1309
00:49:30,420 --> 00:49:28,150
that and all the England's given us as

1310
00:49:32,010 --> 00:49:30,430
El Dorado right okay so I used as a

1311
00:49:33,210 --> 00:49:32,020
punch line back then and it's stuck in

1312
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:33,220
my head as being perhaps the worst

1313
00:49:36,720 --> 00:49:35,650
television show everyone English TV it's

1314
00:49:38,100 --> 00:49:36,730
got to be pretty much up there but I

1315
00:49:40,260 --> 00:49:38,110
love the fact that you still use it as a

1316
00:49:41,940 --> 00:49:40,270
punch line 20 years later when nobody

1317
00:49:43,290 --> 00:49:41,950
recognized it at the time so not only is

1318
00:49:45,150 --> 00:49:43,300
this an obscure reference it's a

1319
00:49:48,360 --> 00:49:45,160
massively dated obscure reference well

1320
00:49:50,430 --> 00:49:48,370
there you go well you know okay well

1321
00:49:52,470 --> 00:49:50,440
okay what would you use a part from Emma

1322
00:49:54,120 --> 00:49:52,480
dial is one that's maybe it's got that

1323
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:54,130
they tried it was really bad never

1324
00:49:57,960 --> 00:49:55,930
unrecognized as it as a recent failure

1325
00:49:59,490 --> 00:49:57,970
on English TV I've got a recent fear you

1326
00:50:01,350 --> 00:49:59,500
know I think most of us so much of

1327
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:01,360
English teles it is a massive failure

1328
00:50:04,190 --> 00:50:02,290
this is the problem I don't think we're

1329
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:04,200
not we're not trying to do anything

1330
00:50:07,920 --> 00:50:06,370
interesting not trying to tell stories

1331
00:50:09,240 --> 00:50:07,930
we're just trying to solve pump stuff

1332
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:09,250
out so unless you're watching something

1333
00:50:12,810 --> 00:50:11,050
on bbc4 which tends to do reasonably

1334
00:50:15,000 --> 00:50:12,820
well anything out on the main stream

1335
00:50:16,980 --> 00:50:15,010
channels is pretty dire all the decent

1336
00:50:18,240 --> 00:50:16,990
Ellie is coming from America I'll still

1337
00:50:20,280 --> 00:50:18,250
hold my hands after that you know things

1338
00:50:22,050 --> 00:50:20,290
like you've got your your house of cards

1339
00:50:23,160 --> 00:50:22,060
your Boardwalk Empire Sopranos are still

1340
00:50:24,450 --> 00:50:23,170
peerless I

1341
00:50:26,490 --> 00:50:24,460
I think I only ever watch American

1342
00:50:28,319 --> 00:50:26,500
television the answer the secret shame

1343
00:50:29,819 --> 00:50:28,329
is that you didn't tell them last night

1344
00:50:32,130 --> 00:50:29,829
you never got around to telling them

1345
00:50:33,870 --> 00:50:32,140
that you don't care for doctor who will

1346
00:50:36,510 --> 00:50:33,880
that much don't see it let's don't [\h__\h]

1347
00:50:37,799 --> 00:50:36,520
out loud when I can I've lost so many

1348
00:50:39,870 --> 00:50:37,809
fans but I don't wanna be like lynched

1349
00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:39,880
on the way out yes I don't like Doctor

1350
00:50:43,559 --> 00:50:41,530
Who yes I've never seen episode don't

1351
00:50:45,150 --> 00:50:43,569
tell anyone that's just embarrassing so

1352
00:50:47,579 --> 00:50:45,160
you also not not a fan of the work of

1353
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:47,589
Shatner yeah I've got I've got a

1354
00:50:51,990 --> 00:50:49,210
grudging admiration for Shatner based on

1355
00:50:53,819 --> 00:50:52,000
his cover of common people which is for

1356
00:50:56,400 --> 00:50:53,829
me that is the absolute Heights that

1357
00:51:10,560 --> 00:50:56,410
anyone has ever achieved in any type of

1358
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:13,540
my name is Carrie papi hi I'm Steve

1359
00:51:19,240 --> 00:51:15,650
Cogan this is Richard Saunders fight

1360
00:51:21,070 --> 00:51:19,250
George Rob here I'm Jay novella I can

1361
00:51:23,320 --> 00:51:21,080
tell you what I hate about QED would I

1362
00:51:26,290 --> 00:51:23,330
really hate is that it comes to an end

1363
00:51:28,900 --> 00:51:26,300
each year QED for me it's just a

1364
00:51:32,020 --> 00:51:28,910
wonderful opportunity to hear lots of

1365
00:51:33,820 --> 00:51:32,030
speakers hearing the crunch of 350

1366
00:51:36,130 --> 00:51:33,830
people purposely and simultaneously

1367
00:51:38,770 --> 00:51:36,140
overdosing on homeopathic pills for the

1368
00:51:46,140 --> 00:51:38,780
10 23 event was a sound I will never

1369
00:51:48,910 --> 00:51:46,150
forget it's simply one of the better

1370
00:51:51,490 --> 00:51:48,920
skeptical conventions anywhere in the

1371
00:51:55,390 --> 00:51:51,500
world and you're you're asking me what I

1372
00:51:57,340 --> 00:51:55,400
think a QED I haven't been the QED and

1373
00:51:59,320 --> 00:51:57,350
also because it's such a personable

1374
00:52:00,820 --> 00:51:59,330
event to actually meet quite a few of

1375
00:52:04,090 --> 00:52:00,830
these people for the first time because

1376
00:52:06,190 --> 00:52:04,100
you will meet many many fun and

1377
00:52:09,120 --> 00:52:06,200
interesting people you will see great

1378
00:52:11,950 --> 00:52:09,130
talks by some of the best thinkers and

1379
00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:11,960
you'll also meet people who have a drive

1380
00:52:16,270 --> 00:52:13,610
and a passion for making the world

1381
00:52:19,840 --> 00:52:16,280
better by protecting people and not

1382
00:52:21,340 --> 00:52:19,850
being dicks about it you know right down

1383
00:52:24,610 --> 00:52:21,350
to people who I maybe wouldn't have

1384
00:52:26,950 --> 00:52:24,620
heard of without QED calm I would be an

1385
00:52:30,460 --> 00:52:26,960
epic guest because I could speak in a

1386
00:52:32,650 --> 00:52:30,470
flawless British accent hello everyone

1387
00:52:36,040 --> 00:52:32,660
like that and everyone would be like who

1388
00:52:40,570 --> 00:52:36,050
is this English guy are you invading me

1389
00:52:43,630 --> 00:52:40,580
he'd love to go QED 2015 April the 24th

1390
00:52:45,520 --> 00:52:43,640
the 26th in Manchester England 12 main

1391
00:52:48,700 --> 00:52:45,530
stage speakers eight panels three

1392
00:52:52,090 --> 00:52:48,710
comedians and 500 friends and the

1393
00:52:53,590 --> 00:52:52,100
massive party tickets on 99 pounds or 69

1394
00:52:58,570 --> 00:52:53,600
pounds for students for the weekend

1395
00:53:12,839 --> 00:52:58,580
including saturday night www QED korg to

1396
00:53:20,099 --> 00:53:18,180
I give a listening to the skeptic zoned

1397
00:53:23,130 --> 00:53:20,109
in the next week I hope to visit my old

1398
00:53:25,380 --> 00:53:23,140
friend Eugenie Scott and maybe visit a

1399
00:53:27,900 --> 00:53:25,390
few scientific places around the san

1400
00:53:30,719 --> 00:53:27,910
francisco bay area before jetting off

1401
00:53:32,549 --> 00:53:30,729
home yes a very quick trip this time

1402
00:53:35,729 --> 00:53:32,559
around thank you to those people who

1403
00:53:38,969 --> 00:53:35,739
have just recently subscribed to the

1404
00:53:42,960 --> 00:53:38,979
skeptic zone via paypal at ww skeptics

1405
00:53:45,239 --> 00:53:42,970
on TV your little a weekly contribution

1406
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:45,249
micropayment they call it means that the

1407
00:53:48,900 --> 00:53:47,170
show continues thank you thank you very

1408
00:53:50,729 --> 00:53:48,910
much and if you enjoy listening to the

1409
00:53:53,039 --> 00:53:50,739
zone and they mean something to you and

1410
00:53:54,749 --> 00:53:53,049
you get something out of it maybe you

1411
00:53:57,239 --> 00:53:54,759
would think that a dollar a week or less

1412
00:53:58,799 --> 00:53:57,249
actually has 99 cents a week is worth it

1413
00:54:01,229 --> 00:53:58,809
for you to keep listening to the show

1414
00:54:03,420 --> 00:54:01,239
it's much appreciated and it means we

1415
00:54:06,059 --> 00:54:03,430
can do skeptical investigations i can

1416
00:54:08,870 --> 00:54:06,069
buy equipment for the reporters and so

1417
00:54:11,549 --> 00:54:08,880
on and it's nice to buy maynard lunch

1418
00:54:13,469 --> 00:54:11,559
anyway for this week this is Richard

1419
00:54:20,130 --> 00:54:13,479
Saunders signing off from the San

1420
00:54:23,519 --> 00:54:20,140
Francisco Bay Area California you've

1421
00:54:28,109 --> 00:54:23,529
been listening to the skeptic zone visit

1422
00:54:30,599 --> 00:54:28,119
our website at www skeptics on TV for